tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37355934.post6854318780127132490..comments2023-09-29T07:50:24.478-04:00Comments on Hero Goggles - All things comics and maybe a little more!: Never give a Dynamic Man an even breakcash_gormanhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04016914226368450646noreply@blogger.comBlogger4125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37355934.post-32682616895591949932008-03-05T15:19:00.000-05:002008-03-05T15:19:00.000-05:00I assumed that most of the capturing of the heroes...I assumed that most of the capturing of the heroes occurred post-war but that would make the plot make less sense. I made that assumption because some like the Yank, Black Terror, the Face, and the Target and Targeteers had post-war stories and Miss Masque didn't even make her debut until 1946!<BR/><BR/>I'm willing to give them a pass in fighting in the War. Other than the companies that make up DC, the heroes of the time, especially the patriotic ones tended to be a bit more involved with the War than content with staying on the homefront. Because of this, I don't think it's a coincidence that DC didn't really have a Captain America or Shield type character until they "acquired" Quality and Fawcett. While most stories with the enemy would still involve spies and saboteurs more often than not, the various heroes of the different companies still made enough excursions into enemy territory to accept an extrapolation of going to war as shown in SUPERPOWERS. Cases in point, Harvey's Shock Gibson operated in the Pacific Theater during the War while the Target and the Targeteers each enlisted in a different branch to be brought together for special cases or trouble they got into on their own. Some like the Gibson's SPEED co-stars Captain Feedom and Black Cat were indeed tied a bit too much to their milieu/status quo to venture too much into the War Effort, but I think there's enough precedent to allow some elasticity here with the basic conceit.cash_gormanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04016914226368450646noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37355934.post-73111282299586064782008-03-05T11:27:00.000-05:002008-03-05T11:27:00.000-05:00Excellent summation of the "Dark" trend in your Co...Excellent summation of the "Dark" trend in your Comment, Cash.<BR/><BR/>I've only read SUPERPOWERS #0 so far, but I don't get the whole urn thing. The General (if he's supposed to be Eisenhauer it's a poor likeness)replies to Yan's line about "evil beyond human capacity" with "You're wrong, Yank. Hitler's merely expanding our understanding of human nature." But then he immediately buys into the whole demons-responsible-for-all-the-evil-in-the-world plot. <BR/>So it was wrong for Yank to imprison the heroes in the urn, but why? It's not clear whether the whole evils-from-the-urn theory was false and humanity is responsible for its own destiny, or the evils are real but trapping the heroes was the wrong way to defeat them. Point was made that the Allies would win the war easily if the urn was resealed but we won with the evils still unleashed. The Yank's narration was that of a crazy person either way. If if he was right, I didn't like him "sacrificing" his fellows without their knowledge or consent. <BR/>I like the art, but this is, what, the fourth revival of these characters, not counting the originals? (AC with the new Green Lama seems to have two different versions.) Why use Golden Age heroes at all if you're not going to be true to the originals? How about creating new ones that fit the story?<BR/>It's also a retcon in series like this and THE TWELVE to show WWII flashbacks. Few if any costumed heroes fought in the war in the GA titles; they fought crime, super villains, spies and saboteurs on the home front.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37355934.post-56824032027360454522008-03-03T09:05:00.000-05:002008-03-03T09:05:00.000-05:00I have no problem with dark heroes per se. I am a ...I have no problem with dark heroes per se. I am a big fan of the Shadow and the Spider after all.<BR/><BR/>It's the actual changing of the characters into something they weren't that I don't care for. It'd be writing the pulp Spider but writing him as an insane person because in the real world he'd have to be insane and dangerous. That's being unfair and disingenious with the character though. He doesn't exist in the real world, it's taking him out of proper context, making him serve the writer's agenda instead of the writer telling a story that honestly serves the character.<BR/><BR/>Making Dynamic Man a racist bigot (THE TWELVE) or pyscopathic murderer (SUPERPOWERS) is wrong because it alters the character to a point that makes it difficult to make the character salvageable as a superhero.<BR/><BR/>And take a look at the major superhero stories that have gotten so much attention the last few years: IDENTITY CRISIS, COUNTDOWN, INFINITE CRISIS, AVENGERS DISASSEMBLED, HOUSE OF M, CIVIL WAR, it's ALL been taking Heroes vs. Heroes. All the projects involving GA characters to a large degree have been exactly the same post-modern crap of the heroes being made more mundane and the threat. The darkening more "realistic" take on the Invaders and heroes vs heroes was all the comic BATTLE HYMN even had going for it. Even AGENTS OF ATLAS, probably the best of the lot, fell into the trap of taking a character as bright and colorful as Marvel Boy and making him mundane, dull and literally gray as the Uranian and then having the whole team join the terrorist organization they came together to fight! <BR/><BR/>What I like about THE TWELVE right now is that it is character driven, scenes like with Captain Wonder visiting his wife's grave is powerful in its honesty. And the areas I don't like is where they play dishonestly such as the "tourist" label or just bad writing such as the inconsistancies in narrative style.<BR/><BR/>And, be honest. The darkening of characters is rarely about philosophical differences. When they first came around, heroes were part escapist from the woes of Depression, corruption, and War. They were less plentiful and they served as championing of the common man where authority was too slow or too corrupt to act. Thus, our superheroes were fighting WWII before America actively got involved.<BR/><BR/>The growth of "continuity" and "universes" has had a backlash effect. Heroes are part of the problem now, they are faulted for the things they were supposed to be active against (this is the underpinning to the otherwise enjoyable JUSTICE series from the SUPERPOWERS team). Thanks to the idea of a strong continuity driven universe, there are too many superheroes residing on a given Earth, that it's become impossible for modern writers to exercise their suspension of disbelief when it comes to writing superheroes. There's too many of them and they're too powerful for them to be outsiders. Their failure to cure homelessness, drought, famine in the real world which is reflected in their fictional world indicts them as being ineffectual. And if they are taken to the extensions of being powers of change, then they and their battles become dangerous to the general populace or they overstep the bounds of superheroes and become fascists. Either way, they cease to be the type of people we are to escape reality with and who inspire us towards wonder and trying to be better than we are, even if it's tying a sheet to our necks and pretending to fly. No, they become warnings to us, the dangers of power even when intentions are good. Something is seriously wrong when THE WATCHMEN actually becomes a more hopeful and optimist treatment of the Charlton characters than the main DCU.<BR/><BR/>I'm not saying that particular story shouldn't be told, that it doesn't have validity. But, for superheroes, especially superhero universes, it shouldn't be the prevalent story being told. Unless you really want your sole audience to be just older more cynical readers. In the end, you're changing the genre. It's not about superheroes and supervillains. The genre that these darker and more "philosophical" tales are supposed to be a darker reflection of is gone and we're just left with the reflection.cash_gormanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04016914226368450646noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37355934.post-8514885486019861952008-02-29T22:04:00.000-05:002008-02-29T22:04:00.000-05:00I suspect we are coming at the project with entire...I suspect we are coming at the project with entirely different mindsets and expectations, but to me, the problem with <I>Superpowers</I> is not so much that it makes heroes dark as that it makes heroes dark in fairly uninspired, decisively unoriginal ways. We've seen this sort of thing before with <I>Watchmen</I>, <I>Miracleman</I>, etc. That might have been easier to overlook if the characters were well-developed and multi-dimensional, but that is not the case, either. I mean, <I>The Twelve</I> also retreads certain aspects of earlier Golden Age revivals, but at least there, we got interesting characters we can actually invest in. <I>Superpowers</I> characters... not so much.<BR/><BR/>Personally (and this is where I suspect we will never agree because, once again, we seem to approach superhero comics from very different perspectives), I think superhero comics work much better when noble, altruistic heroes are allowed to co-exist less moral, if not downright immoral heroes. At the very least, superheroes work better when they view the world through different perspectives, with their own experiences and biases affecting the way they approach their calling. I mean, if nothing else, look at Golden Age - we had killer vigilantes, heroes that refused to take lives directly while killing people by proxy, heroes that refused to take life either directly or indirectly, etc. The story becomes much more interesting when those divergent perspectives are allowed to play against each other. Superheroes don't have to fight per se, but philosophical disagreements never hurt anybody, you know? <BR/><BR/>Re: Black Terror's costume<BR/><BR/>I assumed that his time in the urn altered him somehow, and the costume change was a manifestation of that. Notice that he also spouted shadow-based powers he didn't possess before - another indicator that he came out a touch differently.Strannikhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09561207510297423737noreply@blogger.com